There's a related section about 'mathiness' in section 3.3 of the article "Troubling Trends in Machine Learning Scholarship" https://arxiv.org/abs/1807.03341. I would say the situation has only gotten worse since that paper was written (2018). However the discussion there is more about math which is unnecessary to a paper, not so much about the problem of math which is unintelligible or, if intelligible, then incorrect. I don't have other papers off the top of my head, although by now it's my default expectation when I see a math-centric AI paper. If you have any such papers in mind, I could tell you my thoughts on it.
Troubling Trends in Machine Learning Scholarship
Zachary C. Lipton, Jacob Steinhardt
2018 · arXiv
- HN score
- 0
- Mentions
- 4
- Readers
- 4
- Months
- 4
From the abstract
Collectively, machine learning (ML) researchers are engaged in the creation and dissemination of knowledge about data-driven algorithms. In a given paper, researchers might aspire to any subset of the following goals, among others: to theoretically characterize what is learnable, to obtain understanding through empirically rigorous experiments, or to build a working system that has high predictive accuracy. While determining which knowledge warrants inquiry may be subjective, once the topic is fixed, papers are most valuable to the community when they act in service of the reader, creating foundational knowledge and communicating as clearly as possible. Recent progress in machine learning comes despite frequent departures from these ideals. In this paper, we focus on the following four patterns that appear to us to be trending in ML scholarship: (i) failure to distinguish between explanation and speculation; (ii) failure to identify the sources of empirical gains, e.g., emphasizing unnecessary modifications to neural architectures when gains actually stem from hyper-parameter tuning; (iii) mathiness: the use of mathematics that obfuscates or impresses rather than clarifies, e.g., by confusing technical and non-technical concepts; and (iv) misuse of language, e.g., by choosing terms of art with colloquial connotations or by overloading established technical terms. While the causes behind these patterns are uncertain, possibilities include the rapid expansion of the community, the consequent thinness of the reviewer pool, and the often-misaligned incentives between scholarship and short-term measures of success (e.g., bibliometrics, attention, and entrepreneurial opportunity). While each pattern offers a corresponding remedy (don't do it), we also discuss some speculative suggestions for how the community might combat these trends.
Metadata: arXiv. Abstracts retain their original authors’ rights.
In the conversation
Original HN comments, with labels from simple text rules. A label describes the whole comment and may miss context or irony. Read the discussion to make up your own mind. About the labels
4 selected excerpts · 4 total mentions
It's very bad in CS as well. See e.g.: https://arxiv.org/abs/1807.03341 IIRC there was also a paper analyzing how often results in some NLP conference held up when a different random seed or hyperparameters were used. It was quite depressing.
You may like the article "Troubling Trends in Machine Learning Scholarship", Lipton & Steinhardt, 2018 https://arxiv.org/abs/1807.03341 Especially the trend of "misuse of language, e.g., by choosing terms of art with colloquial connotations or by overloading established technical terms"
> Would you say that you'd have got an AI researcher position without a Ph.D.? It's difficult to get any true researcher position without a PhD. It doesn't mean that PhD has to be in AI. Research involves a lot of reading and writing papers, which a PhD is supposedly training you how to do. That said most places will say "equivalent practical experience" and it's entirely possible to be competent in AI/ML without a PhD. I did a PhD in space science, I now do machine learning in ecology and spent the summer working on machine learning for disaster management. The interesting jobs (to me) are where domains cross, and it's also (hint hint) much easier to get a job doing AI…
Read the full comment
for X than it is doing "fundamental AI". In any case, you're often doing stuff that nobody has done before anyway, but you don't need to spend your life hunting for the new ResNet. > Also, why is NEURIPS or ICML papers is not a hiring guarantee? What the OP probably might be implying is that everyone has a publication in NeurIPS nowadays. I think it goes deeper than that though, publishing in machine learning is broken. Having 10k people at one conference is not an efficient way to distribute research. You have to submit a full paper in November for a conference next Summer - pretty much only computer science does this madness. What's interesting is how unique this attitude is. In astronomy, for example, conferences are a fun place to catch up with folks in your niche. There might be a few hundred people and probably it'll be single-track. We publish whatever journal is the most relevant and they're generally all considered equivalent. Nobody cares if you publish in ApJ vs A&A vs MNRAS, if your research is good. There are also concerns that the quality of these venues is decreasing because the pressure to publish in them is so high. See https://arxiv.org/abs/1807.03341
Keep following the thread.
More in Machine learningMore from the same topics.
On proof and progress in mathematics
William P. Thurston
In response to Jaffe and Quinn [math.HO/9307227], the author discusses forms of progress in mathematics that are not captured by formal proofs of theorems, especially in his own work in the theory of foliations and geometrization of 3-manifolds and dynamical systems.
Sparks of Artificial General Intelligence: Early experiments with GPT-4
Sébastien Bubeck, Varun Chandrasekaran, Ronen Eldan +11
Artificial intelligence (AI) researchers have been developing and refining large language models (LLMs) that exhibit remarkable capabilities across a variety of domains and tasks, challenging our understanding of learning and cognition.
A Critique of the CAP Theorem
Martin Kleppmann
The CAP Theorem is a frequently cited impossibility result in distributed systems, especially among NoSQL distributed databases.
Language Models are Few-Shot Learners
Tom B. Brown, Benjamin Mann, Nick Ryder +28
Recent work has demonstrated substantial gains on many NLP tasks and benchmarks by pre-training on a large corpus of text followed by fine-tuning on a specific task.