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The impact of free-ranging domestic cats on wildlife of the United States

Scott R. Loss, Tom Will, Peter P. Marra

2013 · Nature Communications

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Original HN comments, with labels from simple text rules. A label describes the whole comment and may miss context or irony. Read the discussion to make up your own mind. About the labels

20 selected excerpts · 33 total mentions

Brybry
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> Free-ranging cats on islands have caused or contributed to 33 (14%) of the modern bird, mammal and reptile extinctions recorded by the International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN) Red List [1] Cats are probably a leading cause of mortality in birds. [2] Domestic cats are not native to North America. The birds here would not have evolved to avoid them (and beyond that, domestic cat numbers are not limited by prey availability because they're pets bred and fed by humans). You'll find plenty of studies with evidence that domestic cats are probably bad for bird populations. [3][4] But to be fair, buildings/glass windows kill a lot of birds too. [5] [1]…
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https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 [2] https://www.fws.gov/library/collections/threats-birds#:~:tex... [3] https://www.mdpi.com/1424-2818/13/7/322 [4] https://wildlife.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/wsb.737 [5] https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal...
Original comment Woman who never stopped updating her lost dog's chip reunites with him after 11y
trhway
Neutral mention · rule
>Probably best to keep your cats inside even if you do get another one, considering the devastating effect they have as an invasive species on local wildlife. [1] >[1] https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 You're posting an article by the Smithsonian department employing that felon convicted for animal cruelty toward cats. Wrt. the article itself - it has pretty much no scientific merits as, not surprisingly given the authors' agenda, the article has an obvious fundamental flaw disqualifying it from science - it doesn't specify how many of that wildlife killed by cats were old/ill who would be anyway killed by other predators if it were a natural setting and not a…
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developed area where the only predators left are cats. If we to believe the article's total numbers then it would really mean what the cats are just doing the job of other predators pushed out by humans. Killing the old/ill birds, reptiles, mammals by predators is good for those birds, reptiles, mammals species. (and around humans say an old/ill bird not killed by cats would become a dead bird and a food for rats or something like this)
Original comment In a milestone for Manhattan, a pair of coyotes has made Central Park their home
MikeKusold
Neutral mention · rule
We shouldn't even be doing that for cats. Domestic cats are an invasive species that decimate the native wildlife. "free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.3–4.0 billion birds and 6.3–22.3 billion mammals annually."[0] Since we're talking about Florida, this is what their Fish & Game department has to say on the topic: > * Domestic cats are not a part of Florida’s natural ecosystem. A single individual free-ranging cat may kill 100 or more birds and mammals per year. Scientists in Wisconsin estimate that cats kill at least 7.8 million birds per year in that state alone. Even cats with bells on their collars kill or injure birds and small mammals. > * Cats compete with native…
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wildlife and can spread disease. Outdoor cats have been identified as the primary host in the transmission of toxoplasmosis to wildlife, a disease which has caused death in manatees and other mammals. [0]: https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 [1]: https://myfwc.com/wildlifehabitats/nonnatives/feral-cats/
Original comment One of Florida's most lethal python hunters
bjourne
Neutral mention · rule
"We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.3–4.0 billion birds and 6.3–22.3 billion mammals annually. Un-owned cats, as opposed to owned pets, cause the majority of this mortality. Our findings suggest that free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals." https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380
Original comment 28-ton, 1.2-megawatt tidal kite is now exporting power to the grid
pvaldes
Neutral mention · rule
Fair point. This is the original article in nature. https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380?WT.mc_id=FBK_NCOM... "Methods: We searched JSTOR, Google Scholar, and the Web of Science database [...] within the Web of Knowledge search engine [...] to identify studies that document cat predation on birds and mammals" "We initially focused this search on US studies, but due to a limited sample of these studies, we expanded the search to [...] other temperate regions. We also searched for studies providing estimates of cat population sizes [on] the contiguous USA and for US studies that estimate the proportion of owned cats with outdoor access and the proportion of cats that…
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hunt wildlife. [Our] search terms included: ‘domestic cat’ [combined] with ‘predation,’ ‘prey,’ ‘diet,’ ‘food item’ and ‘mortality’;" "We estimated wildlife mortality in [...] USA by multiplying data-derived probability distributions of predation rates by distributions of estimated cat abundance" "[]" edited by me for clarity Data-derived distributions based on a poor sample were extrapolated to every ecosystem in US? Data with a special focus on temperate areas were extrapolated to temperate and non temperate? Have deserts the same amount of birds as forests? Assuming that preys are equally distributed on USA would need to assume that every ecosystem is equal, or that cats are equally successful chasing birds in all terrains. This seems unlikely. To start because birds migrate and its distribution is patched. Cats can't migrate. Taiga in winter don't has the same birds as Florida in winter
Original comment Wind turbines are friendlier to birds than oil-and-gas drilling
arcticbull
Neutral mention · rule
> Agree 100%. Wind turbines killing birds is a disingenuous argument when it comes to climate change. If the people involved in this conversation actually cared about birds, they wouldn't be worried about either. They'd be worried about cats. Cats kill about 20-55% of the entire US bird population every single year. Somewhere between 1.3B and 4B birds per year in the US alone. [1] And an order of magnitude more small mammals (6.3B - 22.3B). It's several orders of magnitude more than turbines and oil-and-gas drilling combined. Studies put the number of birds killed by wind turbines in the US at 140K-690K. That's 0.0035% to 0.05% of the birds killed by cats. It would…
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literally be a rounding error nobody would ever notice if all the wind turbines came down. I honestly can't believe we're still having this conversation in the context of wind power. Put some UV stickers or black paint on them and move on. [3] [1] https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 [2] https://www.denverpost.com/2019/09/20/bird-population-decrea... [3] https://group.vattenfall.com/press-and-media/newsroom/2022/b...
Original comment Wind turbines are friendlier to birds than oil-and-gas drilling
mtlmtlmtlmtl
Neutral mention · rule
Tame outside cats certainly still hunt, but it's really only a hobby. Feral cats hunt for survival. N=1 here, but in about 3 years of ownership my (formerly feral) cat has killed maybe 10 house/forest mice, 2 squirrels, and 1 small bird(he presents all his prey to me, and I keep a rough count to monitor his behaviour), and most of that was before he got a flap 2 years ago. Obviously a feral cat would need to kill a lot more than that just to survive. And he's a large Norwegian forest cat living on the edge of a forest. He could go on an absolute spree if he wanted to. I think he hunted considerably more before the flap because it was often hard to tell for me he wanted to come inside. So he'd get stuck outside for longer and get hungry/bored. If you want some hard data, this seems like a good starting point: https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380
Original comment Cats Kill a Staggering Number of Species Across the World
Retric
Neutral mention · rule
Sure, anything you don’t like must come from biased sources. It doesn’t trace back to a single statistic, multiple independent studies have looked into it. The often quoted 1 billion birds killed is actually below most scientific estimates of around 1.3 to 4 billion: https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 With domestic cats causing ~31% of the ~2.4 billion deaths and strays making up the majority. You can get similar numbers by ignoring domestic cats and simply look at the stray population and roughly estimate how much meat they need to survive and then compare the percentage of bids vs small mammals caught.
Original comment The Original Birders Gave Photography a Run for Its Money
sys32768
Neutral mention · rule
Your cat doesn't know which species are of least concern, and you certainly aren't seeing every bird or small mammal or reptile your cat kills for fun. I recently took a course on ornithology and was stunned by how difficult a bird's life is from the migrations, predations, building collisions, and the sheer amount of work they invest in nesting and raising their young. It's easy to take them for granted until you actually understand what they go through just to exist, unlike a pampered cat who gets to kill for sport. Cat owners who allow their cats outdoors are being cruel to birds and small animals, period. A bell on your cat's collar doesn't make much difference.…
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There's no way to wiggle out of this moral dilemma. If you love nature and want it balanced and protected, then keep your cat indoors. Or, if you can, train your cat to kill only invasive species. https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 https://www.nationalgeographic.co.uk/animals/2020/09/the-232... https://abcbirds.org/program/cats-indoors/cats-and-birds/
Original comment Find my cat: open-source Cat Tracker
godelski
Neutral mention · rule
> viable solutions proposed that can be implemented bottom-up Don't have outdoor cats: https://abcbirds.org/program/cats-indoors/cats-and-birds/ From the cited source: https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 > We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.3–4.0 billion birds and 6.3–22.3 billion mammals annually. Un-owned cats, as opposed to owned pets, cause the majority of this mortality. Our findings suggest that free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely __the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals.__ (emphasis my own) Besides this, your cats will live longer and healthier. Like the average cat lives twice as long (or more) when indoor. Do it for the birds, do it for the squirrels and other small mammals, and do it for your own fucking cat.
Original comment A Third of North America’s Birds Have Vanished
dataviz1000
Neutral mention · rule
"Our findings suggest that free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals."[0] [0] https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 Studies show that outdoor cats kill billions of birds annually. Anecdotally, posting anti cat studies on social media leads to real world threats and cat loving relatives unfriending me.
Original comment A Third of North America’s Birds Have Vanished
m463
Neutral mention · rule
I hate that cats kill birds. "We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.3-4.0 billion birds and 6.3-22.3 billion mammals annually." https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 Honestly, birds are pretty much the only surviving wildlife in many areas and I wonder what our children and grandchildren will encounter.
Original comment How to Clear 500k Feral Cats from New York’s Streets
throwaway_99999
Neutral mention · rule
In contrary. It is you who doesn't like to admit it. Makes sense in a way, as cats are our cute pets and thus emotionally much closer to us than random wild birds. Ironically, those huge cat populations are caused by humans, so in the end humans indeed are to blame. From https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 "Our findings suggest that free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals."
Original comment How to Clear 500k Feral Cats from New York’s Streets
rcpt
Neutral mention · rule
You seriously need a citation to believe that cats kill birds? How the hell do you think they existed for the past million years? jfc Anyway, here you go (from Nature, not mv-voice) https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 > free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.3–4.0 billion birds and 6.3–22.3 billion mammals annually. Un-owned cats, as opposed to owned pets, cause the majority of this mortality. Our findings suggest that free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals
Original comment How to Clear 500k Feral Cats from New York’s Streets
signalToNose
Neutral mention · rule
I remember reading about the number of birds killed by cats. It was a staggering numbers: “We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.3–4.0 billion birds and 6.3–22.3 billion mammals annually.” https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380
Original comment A shocking number of birds are in trouble
schiffern
Neutral mention · rule
Maybe, maybe not. But they're definitely happier lives for the 10-50 wild birds and 50-200 wild mammals a cat will kill every year. Outdoor cats will hunt even when they're well-fed. "The greatest good for the greatest number of [sentient organisms]." https://www.fws.gov/sites/default/files/documents/keep-cats-... https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/moral-cost-of-...
Original comment SpaceX is targeting Monday, April 17 for the first flight of Starship
culi
Neutral mention · rule
> We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.3–4.0 billion birds and 6.3–22.3 billion mammals annually. Un-owned cats, as opposed to owned pets, cause the majority of this mortality. Our findings suggest that free-ranging cats cause substantially greater wildlife mortality than previously thought and are likely the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals. https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380
Original comment Purring is a love language no human can speak

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